Unauthorized debit
Complaint
EI
Country: United States
These people took $399 out of my bank account. When I called 866-442-3943, the number listed next to the debit on my bank statement, they told me I had authorized it but they could not play the recording of the authorization due to a "glitch" in their system. When my bank called their bank to dispute the transaction, the were played a recording that they say was my authorization. This has to be a fabricated recording as I know for a fact it was not me. This is so frustrating. Some one has to stop these people.
Comments
Names connected with similar fraudulent scams are: "medcare rx", "rx smart", and "discount medical services".
Related complaints here:
https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/YBIXTWYIBgA63AjMLpEbZg
https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/bHpGNREZuwCKaQjKXvhNbw
https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/ysKLL9esnwCClAjJi8V6jQ
Most complaints by consumers are that they never authorized the charges, typically never even having been contacted by the scammers. This type of scam appears to be associated with some fraudulent telemarketing operation, but they also appear to either be charging the wrong accounts in error and then attempting to keep the money, or they may be obtaining account information from illegal sources to add entirely bogus charges onto those due to fraudulent telemarketing.
The scammers commonly claim the charges were authorized, often "a year ago", a deceptive claim to allege that the consumer "forgot", or "failed to cancel". Often consumers indicate there is no reason they would have signed up for this, as they have legitimate insurance, lending credibility to the claims that these fraudulent charges have been made without any contact with consumers. Some allegations have been that the scammers claim the authorization was by a spouse, who was already dead, indicating access to old account information. In general, consumers have reported they have no idea how these scammers got their account information.
Consumers report problems in contacting the companies, with false claims they authorized the charges, abusive rudeness, false promises to refund, etc. This type of telemarketing scammer often attempts to delay disputes, apparently attempting to deceive consumers, or string them along past the 60 day FRB Reg. E dispute period.
You ran into an attempt to hang onto your money despite disputing. The reason they had a "glitch" and couldn't play you the "recording" is probably that they hadn't yet fabricated their phony recording.
Note that they didn't try to use it on you, instead they used it to deceive your bank. This is classic "denial and deception" tactics, as deception is most effective when possibly refuting information can be denied the target. The pattern also follows common patterns of "business directory" and "pre-acquired account" telemarking fraud, complete with the phony "recorded authorization" tactic.
Business directory scams, including some based in the Montreal, Canada, area where these scams appear to be centered, have long used doctored or fabricated phone recordings to intimidate small businesses into paying fraudulent bills. The amounts are typically in the $400 to $600 range, very similar to these scam charges.
Bank-affiliate fraudulent "insurance" telemarketing follows similar patterns, but because the scammers already have consumer account information obtained from their own bank, they only have to fabricate the appearance of agreement. They can already place fraudulent charges, so they use fabricated or doctored recordings to either intimidate disputing consumers, or to deceive bank customer service employees, very much like they did here.
Most effective way to handle fraudulent charges is through a fraud dispute with your bank. Dispute the charges as FRAUDULENT, and do so IN WRITING, sent certified return receipt requested to the dispute address from your statement. You will also want to close your account due to fraud, to prevent additional fraudulent charges, since you know your account number is now in the hands of crooks.
You should also back up your claim by filing a theft and fraud complaint with your local police so you can forward a copy of the report, and provide your bank with a fraud affidavit.
Your bank should be able to reverse fraudulent charges as long as you have disputed promptly. It is their job to transfer your money AS YOU DIRECT, NOT as some crook claims you did. That is what a check is, you are saying "Pay to the order of" to your bank.
As you already know, recordings can be fabricated or doctored, and are no more trustworthy than whoever makes them. An alleged recording by someone unknown is an assurance of nothing. A "recording" played by their "bank" to your bank means even less, since neither was a party to the call, nor does your bank even know you well enough to detect a fabricated or edited recording.
Their "bank" is probably just some shady payment processor they pay higher fees to so they ignore high levels of disputes.
If instead they believe a doctored recording over your own fraud affidavit, they are a bunch of bozos, and you should file a complaint against them with the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency for assisting these crooks in stealing your money. It isn't their job to "mediate" between customers and every crook who might want to reach into a bank account, since there are plenty of dishonest people willing to play this game. Any bank that accepts the word of scammers over their own customers is no place to keep your money.
https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/tYc4K1wNsACmMAjLZ-BuTg
What was the name of the scammer's "bank", that your bank claims played them a recording?
For that matter, what is a "bank" doing with a recording anyway? That isn't what banks do. That's what "partners" who are part of the scam do.
Note reports that they are engaged in fraudulent telemarketing, probably from Canada.
Collected "identification":
866-442-3943
258-963-1476
"payless med"
866-889-1899
Sun Quest Marketing
4330 E Knights Griffin Rd Plant City, FL 33565
889 Carnarvon St New-Westminster, BC V3M 1G2
"Jason Miller"
http://www.callcatalog.com/phones/view/866-442-3943
Claim to be with the government, and need bank account numbers to "deposit a government grant check". Elder fraud.
"V.P. - Mon, Nov 23rd 2009 Rating: 0
THE PHONE #866-442-3943 CALLED ON 11-21-09 SAYING THEY WERE GONNA GIVE ME $399.00 INTO MY BANK ACCT. THEY HAD A CHECK THAT THEY HAD STOPPED FOR ME FROM A PRIZE GAS COMPANY AND HAD MY ACCT. # OF THE FIRST 4 DIGITS AND NEEDED THE REST TO MAKE SURE THEY WOULD GET IT INTO THE RIGHT ACCOUNT. THEY ALSO STATED THEY WERE FROM THE GOVERNMENT. I AM 93 AND SOCIAL SECURITY IS MY ONLY WAY OF SURVIVAL. THESE PEOPLE ARE RUTHLESS AND BLOOD THIRSTY AFTER ANY ONE THAT IS WILLING TO TALK AND WILLING TO BELIEVE. THEY TELL LIES TO GET INFORMATION. THEY CALLED ME AGAIN FROM ANOTHER # ON MY IDCALLER THAT ONLY HAD TWO NUMBERS 19 HE WANTED TO REPLACE MONEY FROM ME AND ASK IF I HAD A SAVINGS ACCOUNT. I WAS SMART, I DID NOT GIVE ANY OTHER INFORMATION TO THEM. PLEASE HELP US FROM THESE RUTHLESS PEOPLE THAT PREY ON PEOPLES LIVES."
Note that when confronted they claim to be in Canada, probably to show it isn't worth trying to pursue them.
"shahrokh seyedhosseini - Mon, Jun 29th 2009 Rating: +1
The number is hard to find as it is unlisted but it is associated with 1650 egretway, louisville, co, 80027. the person there claims he is a third party company associated with paylessmed. Then he tells me he is in canada when I tell him I have his address. Since he had charged my bank account I reported this phone and address to the police. This # is associated with the activities of another #(258-963-1476) which calls and asks for personal information under various names such as U.S. grants, etc.
Caller ID: 8664423943"
Note claim to use an alleged "recording" if victim reported to the police. Recording would have to be doctored, as the original pitch was to deposit money into the victim's account, not take it out, and included false claims to be with the government.
"sha - Mon, Jun 29th 2009 Rating: +1
258-963-1476 keeps calling and says he is from U.S. government and asks for bank information in order to deposit a U.S. government grant check. Unfortunately last time they called I fell for it and today my bank account was charged by a company called "payless med". When called the company which claimed to be a third company (at 866-442-3943, the operator there threatened me not to call the police, saying that we have recorded you on the phone giving us information. When I looked up the phone number in the phone directory there was no information on the city or state of the caller nor name of a company.
Caller ID: 258-963-1476"
https://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-866-442-3943
"Shawn - 21 Sep 2009
Called and left no message.
"
We have a hit on the phone number connected with a BBB report on a company in Florida.
Supposedly marketing "vacation certificates and vouchers".
Note the link to a Canadian address in BC.
BBB rating: "F"
http://www.bbb.org/west-florida/business-revi ... ity-fl-90026320
"Name: Sun Quest Marketing
Phone: (866) 442-3943
Address: 4330 E Knights Griffin Rd
Plant City, FL 33565-2216
File Open Date: December 2006
Type of Business: Vacation Certificates & Vouchers
BBB Accreditation: Sun Quest Marketing is not a BBB Accredited business.
The BBB has requested basic information from this company. The BBB has not received a response. Without this information, the BBB may not have current information concerning such things as the company's management or its nature of business.
Additional Locations and Phone Numbers
Additional Addresses
889 Carnarvon St
New-westmnstr, BC V3M 1G2
Canada
Additional Phone Numbers
Tel: (866) 889-1899
Customer Complaint History for Sun Quest Marketing
When considering complaint information, please take into account the company's size and volume of transactions, and understand that the nature of complaints and a firm's responses to them are often more important than the number of complaints.
BBB processed a total of 2 complaints about Sun Quest Marketing in the last 36 months, our standard reporting period. Of the total of 2 complaints closed in 36 months, 0 were closed in the last year.
Delivery Issues
No Response
1 - Company failed to respond to BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Refund or Exchange Issues
No Response
1 - Company failed to respond to BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
..."
Second number. Looks like it has been connected to telemarketing fraud for almost 2 years.
https://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-258-963-1476
Consistent with a "government grant" scam, again with a Florida connection.
"Charlie - 13 Feb 2008
Guy had a very stong accent wanting to know something about a grant. (could barley understand him) Said his name was Jason Miller from Florida???"
Search on "4330 E Knights Griffin Rd"
Expired contractor's license, may indicate a mail drop.
http://www.hillsboroughcounty.org/pgm/resourc ... pe=5&print=true
Domain registration tied to address. May be just a mail-drop, mail forwarder.
http://www.who.is/whois/qualycon.com/
"QUALYCON.COM WHOIS
Updated: 1 second ago
Registration Service Provided By: Enom, Inc
Contact: @enom.com
Visit: www.enom.com
Domain name:
Registrant Contact:
Intercontinental Marketing
NULL NULL ()
Fax:
4330 E Knights Griffin Rd
Plant City, FL 33565-2216
US
Administrative Contact:
Intercontinental Marketing
John S Streb (@DYNASTYVACATION.COM)
941 853-1104
Fax: (941) 853-1204
7021 Ranch Rd.
Lakeland, FL 33809-2270
US
Technical Contact:
Intercontinental Marketing
John S Streb (@DYNASTYVACATION.COM)
941 853-1104
Fax: (941) 853-1204
7021 Ranch Rd.
Lakeland, FL 33809-2270
US
..."
Bingo!
This is interesting. Same name, same phone number, same business ("Vacation Certificates & Vouchers"), but with a "1320 State Route 9, Champlain, NY 12919" address, which is a "mail-drop" mail forwarder near the Canadian border known to have been used by cross-border Canadian scammers, including a couple of the past "medical discount" scammers. Puts them within reach of the Montreal telemarketing fraud call centers.
http://www.bbb.org/upstate-new-york/business- ... n-ny-152706652/
Name: SunQuest Marketing Inc.
Phone: (866) 442-3943
Address: 1320 State Route 9, Champlain, NY 12919
Business Category: Vacation Certificates & Vouchers
BBB file opened: March 15, 2007
Customer Complaint History
The company's size, volume of business and number of transactions may have a bearing on the number of complaints received by the BBB. The complaints filed against a company may not be as important as the type of complaints, and how the company has handled them. The BBB generally does not pass judgment on the validity of complaints filed.
Number of complaints processed by the BBB
since the firm's BBB file was opened in March 2007: 2
in the last 12 months: 0
Complaints Concerned:
Selling Practices (1 complaints)
1 Company did not respond
Refund Practices (1 complaints)
1 Company did not respond
..."
Also file complaints with RCMP.
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/qc/services/colt/fraudes-fraud-eng.htm
"1320 State Route 9, Champlain, NY 12919" appears to be "Freeport Forwarding". They appear to be both a mail drop, and an order fullfillment house.
http://freeportforwarding.com/
This same pattern has been a common characteristic of Canadian telemarketing-related "health card" scams for several years, showing up under several names.
Other complaints indicate a steady stream of reports of fraudulent charges directly to consumer checking accounts without prior contact. There are also other reports that such fraudulent charges were "substantiated" with doctored or fabricated recordings, or phony claims to have a recording, which like this case, have been used to deceive bank employees into not reversing the fraudulent charge.
Using doctored or fabricated recordings is a common pattern of fraud in cases of fraudulent telemarketing involving fraudulent charges where the scammers have already obtained consumer account information from other sources. It shows up in bank affiliate fraud, where banks sell their customer lists to "insurance" telemarketers in exchange for a cut, and it has shown up in "business directory" scams, both for use in intimidation of small business owners, and where the scammers had access to phone bill payment aggregators to cram charges onto phone bills.
When a fraudulent telemarketer already has account information (whether checking account or credit card number, or even just the phone number), fraudulent recordings need not be used to deceive the consumer himself, but may instead be used to deceive the billing "gatekeeper", the bank, payment processor, or billing aggregator.
Note that in this case, on being challenged by the consumer, they just happened to have a "glitch" and couldn't play the recording. That recording probably didn't even exist yet, nor did they want to give the consumer any information to use to challenge a fabrication. Yet they did play it to the bank, who would not know fabrication from reality anyway. They conned the bank employee, and by doing so, stole the money. Recordings "prove" nothing, and fabricated recordings have been a part of telemarketing fraud for many years.
Con artists who repeatedly con people know what they can get away with better than the people they are conning. They know they can con bank employees frequently enough for it to pay, and they know there are no consequences if it doesn't work. They have no "reputation" to lose from getting caught, since they can change names like a cameleon changes color.
In many cases, bank employees don't know what fraud even looks like. They may just be some customer service person in a call center trying to resolve a complaining customer, and they may not have dealt with many scams or been trained in what to look for.
They may be crippled by bank policy that sets hard limits on what they "refund" out of their own pocket as a courtesy, what they enter as a fraud dispute, and how they assist customers with disputes of any sort, regardless of what banking regulations require. Those policies often are written to minimize the bank's costs, often ignoring fraudulent charge activity if it is below some threashold deamed not worth spending man-hours on.
In short, among the many bank employees who might end up dealing with a scam charge, there are many without the training or experience to know how to protect their customers. Knowing this, con artists can craft their scam to most effectively evade bank security.
Consumers generally know when they have been scammed. They know their money is gone, and they know they didn't spend it. They don't always know all the details of how it happened, or what to do about it. In particular, they often don't know the dispute procedures under FRB Reg. E or FCBA, or that such disputes have to be made within 60 days. If the scammers can delay or intimidate consumers past 60 days, or if they can con a bank employee into thinking the consumer is mixed-up or incompetent, most consumers wouldn't know how to dispute effectively.
Bank employees often don't recognize a scam staring them in the face. When that happens they are ill-equiped to protect the interests of their customers.
You could be scammed by this even if you are not a moron, if your bank hires morons. Scams continues because they works.
This may indicate access to account information from a payment processor or bank, possibly by paying off an employee.
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news/x_scam.html
Federal law gives you the right to dispute unauthorized or fraudulent charges to your ckecking account under FRB Reg. E, as long as you dispute within 60 days of the statement date of the statement showing the disputed charge.
Send a written dispute to the dispute address from your statement, and send it certified so you have proof of date of sending, and date your bank received it.
These con artists got your account information under false pretenses. You did NOT authorize a charge to your checking account, so their charge was fraudulent. You dispute it as fraudulent.
Their tape was a fabrication. It is common for telemarketing scams to use doctored or fabricated recordings to try to "prove" consumers authorized their fraudulent charges.
Note that there are other reports of this particular fraudulent telemarketing operation doctoring phone recordings. It is very common for telemarketing scams to produce such fabrications.
Include in your WRITTEN dispute the date you first notified your bank of the theft of your money, such as calling them on the phone. FRB Reg. E considers your bank to be constructively notified of the dispute when they have reasonably been notified of it in any manner (phone, letter, walking in the branch), or even when your dispute is first mailed, should they never even get it. They FRB Reg. E 60 day window for timely disputing is met through ANY such constructive notification, whether or not your bank properly handles the fraud dispute.
In addition, contact your local police to file a fraud and theft complaint. Send your bank a copy of the police report, along with a signed fraud affidavit.
If you have any problems getting your money back through your bank, file a complaint against your bank with the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency, at www.occ.gov
They are hiding their trail as much as they can, by not depositing it in a business bank account like any normal business would, but it was still sent through to your bank from some other bank, and your bank can send it back.
You never wrote this check. It is a so-called "phone check", allegedly authorized by you, and then created by the telemarketer using your account information, but that is rebuttable by your fraud dispute substantiated by your fraud affidavit. The only "evidence" to back up this electronic transfer is their allegation and their doctored recording, and they have a record of doctoring recordings.
If endorsements are missing, or unreadable, or not otherwise traceable from electronic records, banking regulations hold that whoever can't send it back further gets stuck. That shouldn't be your problem, nor should it be your bank's problem as long as they handle this in a competent manner in compliance with FRB regulations.
Other links noted above tie this scam to a cross-border fraudulent telemarketing operation. They have been using the same name and phone numbers for several months.
While you are at it, file complaints with:
FTC at www.ftc.gov
www.ic3.gov
FBI and Secret Service, due to wire fraud and fraudulent EFT transactions from Canada.
RCMP at https://www.recol.ca
Based on complaints here, they appear to have been running this scam in connection with this phone number since at least July 1009.
"informed that they are a third party carrier"
That was a lie, to deceive and throw off the attempt to recover funds. The number has been tied to this same scam for many months.
"The check came in as no signature necessary with a stamp "
It's a "phone check", as you would expect from a fraudulent telemarketing operation.
http://www.callcatalog.com/phones/view/866-442-3943
"RJ - Sat, Feb 20th 2010 Rating: 0
My son has had these same people run an electronic check via his checking account. We tried to call the phone number: 866-442-3943 and are only informed that they are a third party carrier. The check came in as no signature necessary with a stamp and went thru a bank called Monticello in Kentucky. I have attempted to call the bank and have had no luck getting in touch with them,if the bank is for real or not at this point I don't know. I caution all to watch your statements closly. We too have reported this and will contact the BBB. Advice report to police and BBB and your bank immediatly. At this point we have not received a call from these crooks, but waiting and will treat them like I would treat garbage."
This may be the Montecello Bank referred to.
http://www.bankatmbc.com/about_us/contact_us.htm
It is not uncommon for cross border scams to use mail-drops or other multiple locations to hide their true location. This scam shows mail-drop connections to both south Florida, and Champlain NY.
The "health plan" is phony, used as a name to slip through people's statements, when just as in this case people confuse it with a legitimate charge.
He is not going to answer questions, and any answers he gives will be lies anyway. His name is not "Trevor", all their names are aliases. He won't be fired because he is doing exactly what he was hired to do: deflect your attempt to dispute a fraudulent charge.
This is a con and a scam. Any appearance of legitimate business is just pretense. They have a long record of complaints of stealing money from people's accounts.
Immediately contact your bank (or your roommate's bank, if he or she cannot deal with fraud), and dispute the fraudulent charges under FRB Reg. E for checking accounts or debit cards, or under FCBA for credit cards. Follow up with a written dispute or fraud affidavit sent to your bank's dispute address from your statement, and close the account due to fraud to prevent additional fraudulent charges.
In addition, contact the police to file a fraud and theft complaint, and get a copy of the police report to use in case these scammers attempt to refute your fraud dispute with your bank.
Do not believe ANY recordings, as they are known to edit or doctor them.
They are evil.
In addition, be sure to close the account due to fraud, to prevent additional fraudulent charges in the future. As long as your active account number is in the hands of scammers, you cannot trust that they will not take additional money, possibly under a different name, and if you fail to take this step but could have, some banks will not reverse later fraudulent charges connected to the original fraud.
Do NOT believe anything they say.
They will claim you signed up for their "health discount" plan, they may even claim they have a recording of your "authorization", they may claim you "authorized" it a year ago and it automatically renewed, they may just be abusive and threaten you, or they may claim you have to send some form to cancel, which you will never receive. They may claaim they are just the intermediate billing company. All lies. Their phone numbers are connected to complaints of several different scams.
.
They had a website a few months ago, since taken down, that had a bunch of logos for various well-known drug store chains, to create the appearance they were legitimate. The "discount plan" is probably worthless. If you want to find out, try calling Walgreens, or Safeway, whose logos they had on their site, to see if they have even heard of them.
They also had various other "membership" and "discount club" offers, in categories often connected to scams.
They are a scam, and they are hiding their true physical location, probably in Canada, to continue the fraud.
From time to time, FTC and RCMP go after cross-border scammers.
Do you know if your mother was ever contacted and conned into disclosing her account number, or did they obtain it some other way without known contact?
In particular, was she ever contacted by anyone claiming to be "her pharmacy", or "with Medicare", or did anyone tell her that "Medicare" would cut off her benefits unless she provided her account number?