Careful, PMP will trash you after the fact...

ComplaintsInternet ScamsPerformance Media Placement

Complaint

0
Karla Coar
Country: United States
Performance Media Placement, dba premiumlocallisting.com, sold our company "First Page Google" marketing.  After tracking NO calls and our listing was NOT on Google's first page, we simply cancelled.  Shame on us for buying in.  However, someone at PMP is now bashing our company at complaintsboard.com.  This is libel but we are too small to fight this larger company.  We had no complaints before severing ties with PMP.  The fake complaint came the day after we cancelled. Be very careful.  They know how to hurt your company online!
Karla Coar, Super Tree, Inc.  Cell: 574-532-0647
Owner and Certified Arborist, Niles, Michigan

Comments

  • +1
    tj
    | 3 replies
    Although complaint forums appear to be some free-for-all, in an anonymous world what lends credibility to a complaint is primarily a pattern of similar problems over an extended period of time, indicating both that they are from independent customers (sources), and that the company appears to not respond to problems.  

    Single one-off complaints don't carry much weight, even when like this they appear detailed, creating the appearance they are real.  

    Orchestrated clusters of complaints often appear to be what they are, an attempt to create an appearance, driven by one person.  Again, the pattern is usually visible to any reasonably intelligent reader, and attempts to fabricate a large pattern of complaints often fail due to the similar date stamps and the same "voice" that undermines the credibility of the complaint and makes it look like a concerted effort by one person.

    There appears to be a grey area in marketing "internet advertising" crossing over into "internet business directories" that may have attracted some "ethically challenged" people.  (At the extreme end, of course, are the fraudulent "business directory" telemarketers.)  Some people believe they deserve to be paid regardless of whether they actually deliver as promised.

    If you have determined that the above mentioned complaint is not an actual customer, perhaps the described job doesn't even match any job you have done, you might most effectively handle this by simply rebutting the complaint in a manner that makes clear that you deal with your customers in a professional manner.  

    The message is in the credibilty it projects.
    • 0
      Performance Media Marketing replies to tj
      You can't hide that easily:

      http://www.performancemediamarketing.com/
      http://www.adworks-local.com/
      http://www.pmplegal.com/
      http://www.pmmmobile.com/

      How many times will you change your name? Whos legit? Obviously not a company that changes websites every few days.
    • 0
      Performance Media replies to tj
      Google is helping to protect businesses who buy Adwords marketing through third parties. They require all third parties to adhere to strict guidelines such as 100% transparency, not making false or misleading claims and the account setup requirements. What does this mean for the business owner using a third party for Adwords management?

      * Google requires these third parties to provide the Adwords customer ID to all business owners: "It's important for advertisers to have the ability to contact Google directly with concerns about a third-party partner. To allow Google to properly investigate and assist the advertiser, we require that you provide your customers with the customer IDs for their AdWords or AdWords Express accounts when requested."
      * Third parties "...must provide your customers with monthly performance reports that include data on costs, clicks, and impressions at the Google advertising account level. When sharing Google advertising cost data with customers, report the exact amount charged by Google, exclusive of any fees that you charge."
      * Management fees must be disclosed: "Third parties often charge a management fee for the valuable services they provide, and end-advertisers should know if they are going to be charged these fees. If you charge a management fee (separate from the cost of AdWords or AdWords Express), let customers know. At a minimum, inform new customers in writing before each first sale and disclose the existence of this fee on customer invoices."

      False claims are described by Google as:
      * claiming false affiliation with Google
      * guaranteeing top placement on Google
      * claiming that ads will appear in Google Search at all times
      * representing free Google products as pay-for-insertion products
      * making false statements about how AdWords costs are calculated
      * offering unlimited clicks

      Read about everything here:
      https://support.google.com/adwordspolicy/answer/6086450

      My opinion is every person NEEDS access to the google adwords account. Access to an account will show how much was actually spent on the advertising, the position of the ads and frequency of ads being shown. If the company does not want to provide report access to an account, request the "Adwords Customer ID" and contact Google directly, they will provide all the information you want.
    • 0
      Karl Perkins replies to tj
      Google is helping to protect businesses who buy Adwords marketing through third parties. They require all third parties to adhere to strict guidelines such as 100% transparency, not making false or misleading claims and the account setup requirements. What does this mean for the business owner using a third party for Adwords management?

      * Google requires these third parties to provide the Adwords customer ID to all business owners: "It's important for advertisers to have the ability to contact Google directly with concerns about a third-party partner. To allow Google to properly investigate and assist the advertiser, we require that you provide your customers with the customer IDs for their AdWords or AdWords Express accounts when requested."
      * Third parties "...must provide your customers with monthly performance reports that include data on costs, clicks, and impressions at the Google advertising account level. When sharing Google advertising cost data with customers, report the exact amount charged by Google, exclusive of any fees that you charge."
      * Management fees must be disclosed: "Third parties often charge a management fee for the valuable services they provide, and end-advertisers should know if they are going to be charged these fees. If you charge a management fee (separate from the cost of AdWords or AdWords Express), let customers know. At a minimum, inform new customers in writing before each first sale and disclose the existence of this fee on customer invoices."

      False claims are described by Google as:
      * claiming false affiliation with Google
      * guaranteeing top placement on Google
      * claiming that ads will appear in Google Search at all times
      * representing free Google products as pay-for-insertion products
      * making false statements about how AdWords costs are calculated
      * offering unlimited clicks

      Read about everything here:
      support.google.com/adwordspolicy/answer/6086450

      If redacted search google for "adwordspolicy answer 6086450" That search does not make sense, but will take you to Googles page and provide other pages with more information.

      My opinion is every person NEEDS access to the google adwords account. Access to an account will show how much was actually spent on the advertising, the position of the ads and frequency of ads being shown. If the company does not want to provide report access to an account, request the "Adwords Customer ID" and contact Google directly, they will provide all the information you want.

      Did the company you speak with claim any of the information that Google says is FALSE? Did you request actual account information from the third party company and were DENIED? CONTACT GOOGLE NOW to get real statistics of your advertising campaign.

      If you feel the company did not live up to expectations, try to work it out with them. If they refuse, Google will attempt to help in any way they can and your credit card company should be willing to help you with any dispuites you have. Just provide both Google and the Credit Card company the contract provided by the company, Googles policy and the statistics Google provides.
  • 0
    tj
    You may have noticed that there appear to be a number of complaint threads on various sites related to this company, with some indications of attempts to, shall we say, manage their image.
  • 0
    seo expert
    If it sounds to good to be true.....
  • 0
    outside looking in
    So, TJ, you are claiming that this complaint above is not from a customer of PMP?  This person put their name and cell number in the complaint.  So, by your logic, this person is also responsible for this list of complaints about Performance Media Placement?

    https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/WbhWX6afrACJIgjLdxnpzg

    I find that hard to believe. Perhaps these guys aren't performing fraud and they just provide a really bad service that doesn't work for a lot of businesses.  The volume and variety of complaints against this company does not suggest that these were not customers of this company.
  • 0
    FTC Complaint
    Make an official complaint about this company. It is very easy to do online: https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/
  • 0
    PMP
    Most of the complaints above are filed by an ex-employee who was terminated for performance reasons. This employee has been blogging us with multiple alias’s since he was terminated in March of 2009. There are many blogs on the Internet  similar to this one.

    Re some of his claims:

    He is confusing the issue between an Adwords Qualified Individual and an Adwords Qualified Company. There is a big difference here. There are no constraints on Adwords Qualified Individuals, just passing the test. On the other hand an Adwords Qualified Company has to have several employees who have passed Google testing, but must be in good standings with Google, including paying Google $100,000 per quarter. Please click the link below and then the O-Z tab and you’ll see the required payments for the United States.

    https://adwords.google.com/support/select/pro ... py?answer=59030

    This ex-employee is also making up the story that “he was called by our sales force”, not likely. We don’t call the homeless, just legitimate businesses. We are a multi-million dollar company and we take a great deal of care that our sales reps are properly trained. We have no need to identify ourselves as Google. Very few companies are Adwords Qualified, this is enough.

    Google recently shut down its phone support to end-users enhancing our value to small businesses. This is a difficult task for a small business to set up properly and maintain. If Google campaigns are not properly developed, this can result in massive differences in the price paid per click. Google rates every keyword in their system with a Quality Score. Companies with low quality scores can pay as much as ten times or more than companies with high quality scores. There is no fallacy that a well set up Google campaign will cost a fraction of a poorly set up campaign.

    This ex-employee states that we have multiple company names and that we “changed their name almost constantly”. A simple whois lookup will show that these names have been registered quite some time ago. This ex-employee is aware of all of these domain names and why we have them. We are a very transparent company. Many of these and why are outlined in the About Us on our site at www.performancemediaplacement.com. For reference, we’ve outlined the URLs sited in this blog.

    premiumlocallistings.com – we market using this URL on Google, as a neutral URL so the resellers don’t have to sell under our URL. This is spelled out on our site in the About Us under www.performancemediaplacement.com

    pll411.com – this is a shortcut to www.premiumlocallistings.com.

    performancelocallistings.com – This is an old URL which we used to use to market our company. pl411.com – this is a shortcut to www.performancelocallistings.com.

    performancemediaplacement.com – This is our primary domain. Please note that we’re very clear about who we are see the About Us on this site.

    g2411.com – this is a shortcut to www.performancemediaplacement.com. This makes it easier and quicker for our sales reps to take customers to our site.

    Reseller Sites

    pll-orange.com – this site was developed for a reseller in Orange, CA.

    premierlocallistings.com – this site was developed for a reseller in Austin, TX.

    nw411.com – this is the URL to a reseller from almost nearly 2 years ago, who is no longer with us. Only this ex-employee would know this old URL.
  • 0
    Marianne PMP Employee
    I have worked for Performance Media Placement for over a year now. I am so happy to say that the majority of our clients are very happy with the services we provide them. We DO get our clients on the first page of Google in the sponsored link section 24/7 with unlimited clicks and the all the pertinent key words. We are a month to month service so we absolutely do everything we can to get the results our sales people promise our clients.   Just this morning a limo company in Napa let his rep here know that instead of dusting off his limos he is now booked thanks to our company.  Last week we got an email from another client that is putting his campaign on pause because he is getting so much business that he can't handle all of it due to the campaign we ran for him. We will hold the cites he advertises with us in and not charge him until he is ready to get up and running again.  He raved about the service he gets from us and about his rep. Yesterday one of our client added a bunch more cities to his campaign. His monthly fee went from $400 to $1500. I'm quite sure that would not have happened if this client was not thrilled by the results we are getting for him.  These are just three true examples of the feed back we receive periodically.  We have had a few sales people who were not being honest and they were fired promptly. I would not work for a company who scams people out of their hard earned money.  I am proud to work for Carl Perkins at Performance Media because I know we are helping people, especially in this horrible economy. I feel good when I lay my head on my pillow at night. If anyone has any questions I would be happy to answer them for you 888 248 2488 ext 108
    Thank you for your time.
  • 0
    Truth in Advertising
    Now that we know that PMP is paying attention... Google charges based on the number of clicks. They do not care how big a city is, only how many clicks you got from it. As for lying, Here is a link TO GOOGLE, ON A GOOGLE SITE, stating that it is a violation of policy to imply any kind of permanence for an ad on Google. They are not listings.
    https://adwords.google.com/support/select/pro ... n&answer=152979

    According to Google, it is a violation of their terms to do the following:
    Selling AdWords as 'listings', implying permanence
    Guaranteeing certain ad placement, or that ads will appear at all times

    It's in the link above, read it. As is selling first page placement, charging a flat fee for bulk keywords, etc.

    So, yes sir, do business with a company that violates Google policy and rips off it's clients in the process.
  • 0
    YouCannotFoolMe
    Please read this page to understand what Google feels are violations of their certification program: https://www.adwords.google.com/support/select ... n&answer=152979

    As you can find within this post and on many other complaint posts this company violates many of Googles policies and laws:

    Cold Calling and automated calls that are illegal in many states:
    https://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-949-859-2301
    https://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-888-243-2488

    Spam:
    https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/Ch3MAZF-YgAJSgjKWaIeRg/3
    http://www.mail-archive.com/cygwin@cygwin.com/msg27204.html
    http://www.mail-archive.com/cygwin@cygwin.com/msg28532.html
    http://www.jimcarroll.com/2003/10/the-lengths-theyll-go-to

    As you can see Google is against the main selling points of this company and what the employees "guarantee":
    * "Deceptive or non-transparent pricing...discounts on keywords, exception to the auction (don't have to pay by CPC, etc.), ability to purchase keywords in bulk..."  - This company promises unlimited keywords and clicks at a flat monthly fee. How many PMP customers receive expense or click reports that show the Adwords budgeting?
    * "Selling AdWords as 'listings', implying permanence" - This is in many of their resellers names and in the name of the site that carries the Google qualification.
    * "Guaranteeing certain ad placement, or that ads will appear at all times" - As you can read in the replies, company sites, employee profile pages and fake testimonials from ignorant PMP employees, the main selling points are statements such as this: "We DO get our clients on the first page of Google in the sponsored link section 24/7 with unlimited clicks..." Please Marianne, check the TRUE attrition rate for this company.

    For any current customers that want to see if this guarantee of 24/7 first page placement is being upheld ask for an "Impression Share Report". This report will tell you the percentage of time the ads were shown during a specific time period. Every keyword and ad should show 100%; if not, the first page 24/7 guarantee has been broken which is a violation of their own contract and grounds for a 100% refund. Request to receive this report directly from Google to avoid any possible manipulation from any employees of this company. The best bet would be to request Report Access to the account. Then you will be able see the data directly from the Google Adwords website.

    More deceit from the company is the use of the qualification logo as can be seen here:
    https://adwords.google.com/support/select/pro ... rc=cb&lev=index
    http://www.google.com/support/forum/p/AdWords ... c25f02a43&hl=en


    Below are some resources to report any wrong doings you may feel this company may be performing:

    http://adwords.google.com/support/aw/bin/requ ... plaint&hl=en_US
    https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/
    http://www.sec.gov/complaint.shtml
    http://www.ic3.gov/default.aspx
    https://odr.bbb.org/odrweb/public/getstarted.aspx
    http://www.onguardonline.gov/file-complaint.aspx
    http://www.sec.gov/investor/pubs/coldcall.htm
  • 0
    PBHLLC SCAM
    More links for this company:
    http://www.complaintsboard.com/complaints/performance-local-listings-c220883.html
    https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/WbhWX6afrACJIgjLdxnpzg/3
    https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/PPI6MohK6QDT9QjMbb8e8A
    http://www.ripoffreport.com/internet-marketing-companies/performance-media-pl/performance-media-placement-ri-8534e.htm
    https://complaintwire.org/Complaint.aspx/hac6JzG8VgDULgjLZl0dog
  • 0
    Who's Legit?!?!
    Obviously not this company if they display the Qualified Company logo yet only hold Qualified Individual status: https://adwords.google.com/support/select/pro ... =12241&hl=en_US

    As you can see, there is a big difference in what PMP discusses on this page, http://www.performancemediaplacement.com/Legitimate.asp, and the qualification they hold.  

    Below are links to the minimum requirements that any company should hold to manage Adwords accounts in my opinion.
    http://www.google.com/intl/en/adwords/reseller
    http://adwords.google.com/support/select/prof ... en&answer=12272
    https://adwords.google.com/support/select/pro ... en&answer=18572

    Any company selling Adwords shouldn't violate Googles polices:
    http://www.adwords.google.com/support/select/ ... n&answer=152979

    You can search for "Google Certified Partners" on Googles website here: https://adwords.google.com/professionals/search/

    Good Luck!
  • 0
    No Contracts
    Do you believe you are owed a partial or full refund? Below is some advice on how to ensure your company receives the advertising as agreed upon. If you find an advertising company has not performed according to their contract it is best to approach them with the evidence and provide your side to try and work out an acceptable solution. If no reasonable solution can be agreed upon there is another solution to possibly getting a full or partial refund. This should only be done if nothing can be worked out between you and the company and all communication breaks down. Call your bank to dispute the charges or chargeback. Only call your bank and dispute the charges for the reason(s) you feel the company did not perform as "guaranteed". In order to truly know if the company is performing as promised good record keeping from the beginning is necessary.

    Here are some tips that could be followed:
    * Request everything any sales person tells you on the phone or in person in writing and/or get permission to record the phone call for your records. This is extremely important as "guarantees" are made by certain sales people that Google employees "...have no problem saying that all of these claims are completely false." As you can read here: http://www.google.com/support/forum/p/AdWords ... 79abadae6&hl=en
    * Request, in writing, how much of your monthly fee will be spent on Adwords and/or the other PPC providers.
    * Request "Read Only Access" to your Google Adwords campaign. You will be able to view the account to inspect keywords, ads, check the pricing and other valuable statistics like the amount of clicks and overall cost. You wont have the ability to make changes, but having access to this information to print out for your records is EXTREMELY important.
    * If report access is refused or you just want to receive the reports, ask them to set up a regular schedule and send you these reports: Overall Campaign report showing pricing and all keywords and ads being used, Search Query Performance report, Impression Share Report, Keyword Performance Report, Ad Performance Report and Geographic Performance Report. These reports should come directly from Googles email: adwords-noreply@google.com.
    * Check the placement of your ads regularly both in Google and using this tool:
    https://adwords.google.com/select/AdTargetingPreviewTool. If your ad cannot be found take and save screenshots for your records.

    If you look over all this information and you feel the performance is not as expected, talk to the company first to maybe gain a better understanding of the information and/or see what adjustments can be made to coincide with the promises made by the sales person. If there is a refusal to stick to the "guarantees" made by the company all the information above could be given to your bank to review your dispute. If you have not been directed to read and/or sign a contract, ensure to emphasize this point to your bank. Below are links showing some guarantees made by the company and the promise of "NO CONTRACTS":
    http://www.ocgoogleguy.com/Businesses/OC_Google_Guy_Trabuco_Canyon_CA.htm
    http://www.linkedin.com/pub/kurt-steinhebel/1a/10b/13b
    http://www.listown.com/writing-editing-translation/oc/201002/143116.htm
    http://www.searchterms.com/blog/local-search/ ... -be-successful/
    These can be printed out and sent to the bank as well.
  • 0
    Fools Gold
    If PMP is such a great company at performing these first page, unlimited click and keyword campaigns that produce massive conversions, why do they not use any PPC service themselves? If they are so great at map placement and other SEO, why can they not be found for ANY relevant keywords surrounding their business?  

    Another thing, why does PMP list that they advertise for people on sites like Yelp, Facebook, Merchant Circle, AOL, etc. as shown on every homepage of their "resellers"? Where are the terms non-existent for these listings in the PMP "contract" that many sales people, IN WRITING, say do not exist?

    Another point, the FAQ on the PMP site states that every client get access to Google Analytics and phone tracking from kall8.com, yet this code can not be found on the landing pages. Why is that? If there is an extra fee for these programs I would imagine it would be stated somewhere within the site, yet it is not.

    Are these examples of "Bait and Switch"? That is left up to interpretation, but here is what the FTC has to say: http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/guides/baitads-gd.htm

    -Begin Quote-
    "Sec. 238.0 Bait advertising defined.1

    Bait advertising is an alluring but insincere offer to sell a product or service which the advertiser in truth does not intend or want to sell. Its purpose is to switch consumers from buying the advertised merchandise, in order to sell something else, usually at a higher price or on a basis more advantageous to the advertiser. The primary aim of a bait advertisement is to obtain leads as to persons interested in buying merchandise of the type so advertised.

    Sec. 238.1 Bait advertisement.

    No advertisement containing an offer to sell a product should be published when the offer is not a bona fide effort to sell the advertised product. [Guide 1]

    Sec. 238.2 Initial offer.

    (a) No statement or illustration should be used in any advertisement which creates a false impression of the grade, quality, make, value, currency of model, size, color, usability, or origin of the product offered, or which may otherwise misrepresent the product in such a manner that later, on disclosure of the true facts, the purchaser may be switched from the advertised product to another.

    (b) Even though the true facts are subsequently made known to the buyer, the law is violated if the first contact or interview is secured by deception."
    -End Quote-

    Please "Marianne", answer relevant questions about the company practices and other points brought up  as opposed to performing "Reputation Management" the company talks about within their many sites.
  • 0
    Ignorant or Lies?
    I viewed Performance Media Placements legitimate page and I am not sure if the discrepancies on their page and the links to Google are on purpose or just typos. Two of the links do not lead anywhere. They also state they need to manage $100,000 per quarter, yet Google states it is only $10,000 for the qualification they hold. How can this company manage others websites and advertising when they can not even manage their own website?
  • 0
    PMP
    The Company qualification was recently lowered from $100,000 as Google is restructiing its qualifications.  You can see a comparison between the old program, which required a quarterly spend of $100,000 and the new one here.
    http://adwords.google.com/support/select/prof ... k&answer=176294

    Please do your homework before posting negative blogs.
  • 0
    PMP Complaint
    Why would it take a "professional" website and advertising company so long to change one digit and two links on their website to reflect current and true information on the products they hard sell to small businesses?

    This is copied from PMP's "Who's Legit" Page right now:
    <*begin quote*>
    A Google Adwords Qualified Company must spend $100,000 per quarter or greater with Google. This requirement can be found here.

    https://adwords.google.com/support/select/professionals/bin/answer.py?answer= 59030

    https://adwords.google.com/support/select/pro ... en&answer=17224
    <*end quote*>

    Old information and two dead links. How can PMP handle keeping their clients sites and advertising updated when they haven't even updated their own sites to reflect current information in months!

    Please be honest to your customers and give them cost data.

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