deceptive sales tactics

ComplaintsInternet ScamsGuthy-Renker

Complaint

0
Jocelyne Houghton
Country: United States
This complaint is regarding Guthy-Renker,which is the parent company of both ProActiv Solutions & VitaPower supplements. I was a satisfied customer of ProActiv Solutions (acne cleansing system) for years, beginning in the mid-90s (before they used celebrity endorsements).  My mother got the account for me & I used the product for many years; we terminated the account only due to accumulating a stockpile of the product. Cut to this summer, when I opened an account with ProActiv for myself. There was an "Introductory Offer" of the VitaPower vitamins for $3.99, and I accepted it.  There was no information about how much the product was after the "introductory offer." When I received the product, it came with absolutely no paperwork - no receipt, no product information, no contact information, no way to accept or decline an actual subscription to the product.  Due to this lack of information, it was unclear that VitaPower was a separate entity from ProActiv.   The fact that there was no product information, receipt or any other paperwork gave me pause, and I did not want to continue with the product (I didn't try it; I  just didn't see fit  to add more vitamins to my regimen).  I should have taken steps to contact the company, but there wasn't any contact info provided with the product, and I promptly forgot about it ... until a month later when $33.99 was taken out of my account by the VitaPower company.  I did then contact ProActiv for VitaPower's customer service number and promptly called to cancel my unwanted and unsolicited subscription, only to get a very sarcastic attitude from the agent when I declined to listen to his lecture about cancelling without trying the product, and trying to keep me from cancelling the account.  I called back again to clarify about the lack of information about the product & subcription status with the shipment of the product & how it was a suspicious & deceptive tactic, to no avail.  I then expressed my displeasure re: the experience with VitaPower and the (lack of)information given when signing up for the "introductory offer" with ProActiv, whereupon I learned that VitaPower is part of the Guthy-Renker "Family" (umbrella company) and, in short, did not care about my negative experience.  I have subsequently cancelled my account with ProActiv.  It's shocking to me that they would be so unconcerned with complaints regarding these dodgy & cheap sales tactics, given that they actually have competition these days. Boo!

Comments

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  • 0
    Teresa
    I have discovered the same con and am livid. I had ordered the pilates circle as an introductory offer and had not received anything else from them but noticed money kept leaving my account on amonthly basis. I looked back and saw that this had happened  a few months in a row. I firstly called the bank and they said they would send out fraud papers as I had not authorised these payments. I then went back to the Windsor Pilates website and read all the fine print and everything on returns etc. All I can say is what sneaky, dishonest people. They trick you into committing to more than you realise when you think you are buying one product and then when you discover what is happening it is a nightmare to try and cancel. I emailed customer services and was emailed back saying it was cancelled - that no further payments would be taken and that no further product would be sent. What a cheek as I had not received any other product apart from the original order. I thought that was all sorted but today I discover a payment has been taken. I'm livid. It's the weekend and I can do nothing as the Windsor customer service number only operates Monday to Friday and the banks are closed. I will be straight into the bank Monday and will now follow the fraudulent activity route. I will be revising all my online ordering from now on and most certainly will never purchase from Guthy-Renker again.
  • 0
    agent
    Hello everyone... I worked for this company I find it so sad that everyone is taking all of their frustrations out on the customer service reps they talk to.  They are only going by the company guidelines that were already determined before they got the job.  It's not like we come to work and want to argue with people.  We are only doing what is asked of us.  I constantly got yelled at and called names because of something I had no part of and all these people on this site ranting and raving about bad customer service only call it bad because the rep tells them something that they dont want to hear.  If you purchase our products you have 60 days to return it.  Last time I checked that is 2 months.  It is written all over on our website and it is explained numerous times.  Then tell me why do people call 6 months after the fact and expect a refund because it didnt work?  Now granted I understand sometimes you will get someone rude or not helpful but for the most part the agents do what they are suppose to do.  Another thing is kindness goes a long way when talking to customer service for any company.  If you call cursing and calling everyone names and interrupting everything the agents say how do you expect them to help you.  I dont know where all you people work but being called every name is the book is not fun.  Also when an agent says they cant do something..They cant do it.  Our systems dicate what we can and cant do.  If we give a refund it can take 3-5 BUSINESS days for it to post back to your account not right that minute.  That is something the agent has no control over. Agent also dont personally ship the product to you... there is a whole process where it goes to the warehouse, fedex takes it from the warehouse to your POST OFFICE,unless rushed shipped, and they deliver it to you.  If you dont receive it i suggest contacting the post office to see if they actually did before calling and yelling.  Also if people are patient they will get what they want if it is reasonable.  In our accounts we can postpone, change shipping frequency, customize kits to what you actually use, and even remove your credit card so no automatic charges are withdrawn.  The reps will tell you this but usally we are never allowed to speak, so next time maybe listen.  From my experience people will always come back because they like the product. In closing remember in the beginning customers did order it out of their own free will.  No one put a gun to your head and forced you to order the products.  Be proactive, no pun intended, and make sure what you are signing up for because for legal purposes everything is written there for you to see.  It is up to the consumer to make sure they know what they are buying.  I also put out a challenge for everyone to work a customer service job for a week and then see what people have to deal with.  Also Guthy Renker is no different than any other company.  For example my mom called American Eagle customer service and talked to 5 people just to see if her AE card was still valid because it didnt have an experation date on it.  They have been around forever I dont think the Better Business Bureau is going to take much heed into those claims when Guthy Renker has done everything legally.  Well have a great day and i wonder how long will it take for someone to respond negatively to this post.. I give it a day max.  Peace!!
  • 0
    xkempf
    This is a total rip off! Join the Facebook page and prevent others from this scam!
    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Guthy-Renker-Scam/126152857449200
  • 0
    xkempf
    Join the Facebook page:
    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Guthy-Renker-Scam/126152857449200
  • 0
    xkempf
    Join the Facebook page:
    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Guthy-Renker-Scam/126152857449200
  • 0
    missjane
    | 2 replies
    Oh brother time and time again you people are saying about the replenishment program, to continue to be billed without your knowledge. That is impossible the agent is required to tell all the details of the main offer on the call also it is followed by "...so with your permission I will send you your first month supply and get you started, okay?" If you don't understand that I feel sorry for you! In the infomercials for meaningful beauty and sheer cover it states that you will be sent "seasonal shipments" THAT MEANS you will be sent 90-day shipments every 3 months. So many people DO NOT listen to the WHOLE infomercial and jump the gun and order! ALSO, again on the order the agent asks you if you decide to keep the future 90-day shipments how would like to be billed? You have the choice to make monthly payments or a complete payment for all 3 months at one time. If you do not choose to pay with your credit card you are given the option to send a check or money order in for a ONE-TIME one month supply! SO there is no possible way that you were unaware of the future shipments! What it is that the customer hears what they want to hear and they DO NOT pay attention to what the agent is saying or they are to idiotic to understand! It is quite simple! It's all there right in front of your face! You people just like to [***] and most of you don't have a clue what's going on!
    • 0
      Tom replies to missjane
      I did the proactiv intro pack at 29.95. I used paypal to fund the purchase and future payments. i paid for each shipment automatically. I cancelled the program on 11-09-2011. Each shipment at the time was 39.84 after the initial payment.

      After cancellation no further product arrived. There was no further communication or solicitation(s).

      On todays date, (2-27-13) I received a notice from a firm in the collection buisness called RJM Acquisitions in the amount of 59.90 supposedly due to Proactiv. the letter states the firm had purchased an account (my account) then explains to some detail about proactiv.

      I called the company (RJM) and discussed briefly about the short lived terms of the agreement, what happened and the actual monies that transferred to the seller Proactiv.

      The agent "Mike" closed the account after discovering the amount of 99.84 was an exageration of the amount due (39.84) which was paid automatically by paypal.

      So this guy Guthy Renker sells your cancelled account to another collection agency with a greatly exagerated amount and basically "sicks the hounds" of collection on you, even if you have paid in full apparently from cancelling your/his program.

      What a duschbag.
    • 0
      Kate replies to missjane
      Yes it is possible because they've tried to take £125 through PayPal and I've never even bought anything from them! Never even heard of them until I checked my emails and saw it!!!!
  • 0
    agent2agent
    Well said Agent :)
  • 0
    Shaira
    I purchased sheercover product and I received the product after over a month after they charged my credit card. two days after I received the product they charged my credit card again and I call them to find out whats happening. They said there is another pack that has been posted to me. I called them and question them the reason. they said I can return the product when I received it and they will refund it. I still have not received the second pack they send to me and now every month they charge my credit card for an amount 49.50. this is on top of the two charges of 62.95 inn November and December. I have asked them to pay the amounts they charged my credit card sine 1 December 2010. They still have not. I do not recommend any using the bloody guthy-renker to purchase any product.
  • 0
    shaira
    I am sure you have time to b...h about it. That is not true, what you have commented.
  • 0
    dexter
    I have had terrible trouble getting the pro-activ deliveries cancelled. Guthy Renker always state that "we'll take your number and someone will get back to you within 24 hours". They never get back to you. I threatened to go to Trading Standards today and lo and behold they cancelled the order and promised me money back on the spot. Their customer service officers are rude and put you on hold for ages whilst they chat to their friends - I know this because they didn't put me on hold properly and I sat there listening to the operator discuss me, her family and a recent meal she had. They are an appalling company and I urge you to avoid them.
  • 0
    Scarlett
    CONSUMER WARNING:
    DO NOT BUY PROACTIV SKINCARE OR ANYTHING SOLD BY GUTHY RENKER IN AUSTRALIA OR OVERSEAS!

    I'm posting from Australia in 2011. I have also had a LOT of trouble after ordering Proactiv skincare online only once.

    Despite thousands of customer complaints online, it seems like Proactiv's parent company Guthy Renker is still getting away with using their deceptive business practices and scamming unsuspecting customers. Like many other posters, I also thought I was only making a one-off purchase online. I've ordered many products over the years (from Australia and abroad), and have never had any trouble.

    No one ever expects (when ordering products once online) that what they are actually doing is giving a company authorisation to keep on charging their credit card month after month for products they don't want. It's not something we, as consumers are used to. Being charged over and over again without our proper consent is something we all feel should be illegal, therefore, scouring for such dubious 'terms and conditions' on websites we order off is not something we ever think to do. Proactiv and Guthy Renker's websites are masters of deception. It's obvious their legal team helps them push the boundaries on how much information they need to provide customers to keep on trading legally.

    Whether or not Proactiv skincare works for customers, the problem with Proactiv and all the other products Guthy Renker sells, is that we buy them online in good faith thinking they will help us solve our beauty/health concerns. From the thousands of other angry customer posts I've read, most of us only want to order their products once initially to try them.

    After I ordered Proactiv early in 2011, Guthy Renker has continued taking money out of my credit card account each month. I questioned Proactiv's sales team and was told I signed up for a 3 payment plan of $49.95 which was certainly news to me!! There was no opt-in box in their shopping cart specifying or alerting me to any of this. The page I ordered from did not outline their $49.95 x 3 payment plan. Strangely, the amounts they take out of my card each month are always different and are never the $49.95 they say I should be paying them.

    The third time I saw money had come out of my account, I formally wrote to Guthy Renker telling them to cancel my 'membership' and stop charging my credit card. They wrote back saying/confirming my membership was cancelled and that they would no longer be sending me products. Unsatisfied, I asked them to give me written confirmation that they will also stop charging my credit card. They never replied and I have noticed, since Proactiv and Guthy Renker confirmed they cancelled my 'membership', that I have oncemore been charged. This is the fourth time they have taken money out of my account.

    I note that (as many other customers have also noted in their online complaints) once you complain to Guthy Renker and then try to log into your 'members' account via their website, you come up with an error message. It appears as though customers who complain and try to firstly cancel their membership via email or phone, are subsequently unable to log-into their accounts to formally suspend their membership. All this despite, Guthy Renker's website saying 'you can cancel at any time' & 'its easy to manage your account online'. Many customers who keep on having their card charged complain that Guthy Renker told them that they never received their online cancellation, thus kept on charging them. It's a little hard to cancel your membership online when your access is blocked by them on purpose!

    My advice to anyone needing help or wanting to help other consumers is:

    Stand up and speak out even if you have resolved your issues with Proactiv and Guthy Renker. We have to let other consumers know what we have all experienced so they don't go through the same terrible experience. Speaking out takes time but I'm sure you'll all agree Guthy Renker needs to be stopped once and for all.

    STEPS TO TAKE TO STOP PROACTIV & GUTHY RENKER TAKING YOUR MONEY:

    1. If you have already made the mistake of ordering Proactiv (or any other brands) from Guthy Renker - Keep an eye on your bank account. As soon as you notice that your card has been charged without your permission, call you credit card provider and dispute/reverse the charges made on your card. Explain that they were unauthorised and get them to investigate the issue. You should be issued with a letter from your bank detailing what transactions you've put under investigation.

    2. Get your credit card provider to CANCEL your existing credit card and then issue you with a new one. Be firm on this and don't back down if they try to talk you out of it. Your bank may say this will not cancel the direct debit Proactiv and Guthy Renker has set up on your credit card. It is worth a shot and (from my experience in Australia) does not take long to do, nor does it cost you any money to do.

    3. If re-issuing a new credit card does not work for you, and Guthy Renker's transactions now divert to your new card, call your credit card provider and completely cancel your latest credit card. It is a bit of a hassle, but going to another provider to get a new credit card should hopefully stop your woes.

    4. Make formal complaints to ALL relevant government offices & TV shows:

    In AUSTRALIA you can contact: Consumer Affairs Victoria, The Office of Fair Trading (Queensland), The Australian Federal Police Scam Watch, The ACCC, notgoodenough.org, A Current Affair, Today Tonight.

    In the US you can contact: BBB (Better Business Bureau), Federal Trade Commission, www.complaintsboard.com, www.ripoffreport.com.

    In the UNITED KINGDOM you can contact: The Office of Fair Trading.

    5. Spread the news - warn everyone you know about Proactive & Guthy Renker! Join the 'Guthy Renker Scam' Facebook page.

    6. As THEY say, Be Proactive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • 0
    Lois Lemcke
    I have been ordiering product from "Sheer Cover" and in one of my orders they suggested that I try a product called "meaningful beauty" and they had a special for $19.99 worth something more. so I said fine add it to my order, which they did. Then a month later I received a package valued at $112.86 which I refused and sent back unopened as I had not ordered it. I called the company immediately and had my name removed. Thank was in December of 2010. I have called to tell them I wanted that amount reimbursed to my credit card, they now say they have no proof that I returned the package. so I am out $112.86. They also prommised me a response but still months later no response from anyone. As far as I am concerned if they steal that amount from hundreds of people that is a pretty good business eh? I will never order that product and may cancel by buying from "Sheer cover" as well.
  • 0
    Nelliebell
    How Guthy Renker has been getting away with this is beyond me. A friend gave me vitamins they ordered, but no longer wanted (Vitaclear, Vitapower, and Endless Youth) and all 3 packs of vitamins had the exact same ingredients! I can't believe they convince people that the same product can do so many diverse things for them.
  • 0
    pssyfootwackatk
    The same thing just happened to me, I was misinformed about the vitamins when I decided to order them, cause what the hell, the price was good at the time. Little did I know they were going to automatically charge my credit card. Well I just recently sent a check to my internet company, and to my surprise it wasnt accepted, because of the automatic payment I didn't realize I had for these vitamins that I dont even want. I do all my school online, and I have finals in a week, and I don't even have $ to keep my internet on for the next month now. I am so pissed, and think I should have had some sort of notice about this charge!
  • 0
    Jenn
    I personally have not had any problems with any of the representatives I have spoken with over the phone, and I agree that a lot of the anger from consumers have been displaced onto the customer representatives. However, the calls you receive are the only real interface that customers have with the company they are disappointed with. I don't believe it is a personal attack on you, the representative, but a means for people to vent their frustrations in the hope that the anger will be relayed to upper management and things will be changed.

    I spoke to several representatives tonight and some others a few weeks ago... all of them were pleasant. I did my best to not transpose any of my negative emotions because I understand that it is not their fault. However, my requests seemed futile. While I understood that charges would be made to my credit card, it was not apparent that their promotional product (the vitamins) would also be charged on a monthly basis. I've attempted several times to rectify the matter, but each time I have been told that they cannot identify the charges based on my account or credit card number. I am fully aware that the agents were not at fault, but, at the same token, I am very disappointed that this very issue has been the subject of so many complaints towards GR. I was happy with the product I purchased but not with the company I have purchased it from.

    Sure, consumers should read the fine print more carefully and be fully aware of the commitments they assume when doing business... but I believe that conducting "honest" business doesn't just mean adhering to the law. I believe it also means being as forthright about their products as possible. I am sure that you have had to deal with a LOT of difficult people. Most, I assume, are complaining about the things you've listed (ie, demands for immediate refund, disregard of the return policy, etc). However, many of the forums, including this one, have posted complaints similar to my own---the promotional product.

    Anyway, I've been mostly just going on a tangent, but I really do feel that you are definitely right. Kindness does go a long way and the representatives are not to blame. I just hope that you also know that it really is just a coping mechanism... just a way to deal with frustration. People are better than they seem. I am in the medical field, so I definitely have had my share of complaints. It helps people to yell sometimes. I know it sounds crazy, but you actually help people feel better at the end of the day for just listening.

    So, to you--the customer service reps--thank you for everything you've done to try to help us, the customers. But to Guthy Renker--the company-- F*** Y**.
  • 0
    Happy Customer
    Guthy Renker's customer service goes a lot further than other customer service departments.  I have never had any trouble with canceling products I didnt want or ordering ones I did.  However I did see that it clearly stated online and on my invoice that I would be automatically shipped another package. Ignorace is not an excuse. Just because you never read the information does not mean it was not there.  They are even open 24/7 which means I can call anytime that I need service.  Get real people.
  • 0
    Scarlett
    REFUND UPDATE:

    I posted on 13th April 2011 from Australia.

    After reporting Guthy Renker Australia to my bank, Consumer Affairs & ASIC I got a full refund for all the unauthorised charges on my credit card. Consumer Affairs in particular was very swift & took action immediately.

    How I got a refund:

    I printed out hundreds of customer complaints about Proactiv skincare and Guthy Renker from my online searches. I sent all these to the government organisations I contacted so they could see that mine was not an isolated case.

    I advise anyone considering ordering Proactiv skincare in Australia or abroad to stay well away.

    Apart from the damaging effects of Proactiv on your skin (& the fact it doesn't even work!) Guthy Renker who sells Proactiv is nothing but a criminal organisation. Read the thousands of customer complaints online to see for yourself.

    I urge everyone to keep on reporting their issues with Proactiv and Guthy Renker to their Consumer Advocate bodies in their relevant country.  Post these bodies a bundle of all the online complaints you can find.

    Stamping out Proactiv and Guthy Renker's shady business practices is dependent on how many of us consumers actually take the time to speak up.

    Good luck.
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